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ce qui lui valut de recevoir

AnneC1Kwiziq Q&A regular contributor

ce qui lui valut de recevoir

I’m not familiar with this use of "valoir" and was expecting a causative construction like "faire recevoir" - can someone kindly help me with a reference?

Also the end of the first sentence "in the women's right struggle"  UK English would usually have "rights" in the plural, as in French.

 

 

Asked 7 months ago
CélineKwiziq team memberCorrect answer

Bonjour Anne,

Thank you for pointing out the typo in the first sentence. It's now been amended.

When using causative Faire the agent (a person) is making someone/something do something to a recipient (Olympes). Here, there is no agent per se as the subject is "which" (= the fact she denounced slavery in several plays)

Take a look at both links (including one of our partners' sites) for the Causative Faire:

Faire – Causative Construction

Faire + [infinitive] = to have something done in French (Causative)

I hope this is helpful.

Bonne journée !

MaartenC1 Kwiziq Q&A super contributor

Céline, did you mean to write ‘ when using the causative, the agent …. is making….’ rather than ‘the agent…. is not making…’ ? 

CélineKwiziq team member

Bonjour Maarten,

That's right, Maarten! That's what I meant to write. I've amended my answer.

Merci de votre excellente contribution ! Bonne journée !

AlanC1 Kwiziq Q&A super contributor

I find the terminology rather confusing, but if I understand Laura's article correctly, it's the subject who makes someone do something. As Céline says, the subject is "which". The recipient (I find this particularly confusing) is the direct object - "many threats". The agent (indirect object in this structure) is Olympe.  

So can't you write something like "... ce qui lui fit recevoir beaucoup de menaces" ?

AnneC1Kwiziq Q&A regular contributor

Thanks for the answers. I still have two issues. The first is the construction "… ce qui lui valut de recevoir de nombreuses menaces" - I’m not familiar with "valoir à quelqu’un de (verbe).." being used like this and was hoping for a reference. Does it imply that it (neutrally) "earned" her the threats?

 Secondly, the English sentence construction "which caused her to receive many threats." seems pretty clearly causative, with "which" as the subject, "her" as the agent and "receive" as the verb. So is it the case that in French an indefinite relative pronoun ("ce qui") can’t be the subject of a causative construction and it has to be a person?

Sorry for such an involved follow-up question!

CélineKwiziq team member

Bonjour à tous,

I do apologise if my answer has confused anyone.

In this case, you cannot use "causative faire". Anne is correct that "valoir" can also mean "to earn somebody something". Take a look here (the last paragraph): French word of the week: valoir

 

@Alan, in this particular case, you will need to use "valoir" and not the Causative Faire. So you will write: "... ce qui lui fit valut de recevoir beaucoup de menaces". Using "fit" (faire) sounds as if you are (literally) receiving / giving someone threats (as if those threats are goods/objects). It's important to remember that part of the inherent meaning of "faire" is to express a literal doing (i.e. making something / doing a physical action etc.)

Il était entré dans la grotte mais il avait peur du noir, ce qu'il lui fit (valut de) faire demi-tour He'd entered the cave but was afraid of the dark, which caused him to turn around

-> a physical action (i.e the turning around)

(@Anne) In the example above, you can see that "ce qui" can be the subject of causative construction.

I hope this is helpful.

Bonne journée ! 

AnneC1Kwiziq Q&A regular contributor

Thank you very much Céline, for such a clear and detailed reply. The Collins Word of the Week blog looks well worth investigating, too.

ce qui lui valut de recevoir

I’m not familiar with this use of "valoir" and was expecting a causative construction like "faire recevoir" - can someone kindly help me with a reference?

Also the end of the first sentence "in the women's right struggle"  UK English would usually have "rights" in the plural, as in French.

 

 

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