The example for dropping 'ne' explétif in speech


Kwiziq community member

30 January 2016

3 replies

The example for dropping 'ne' explétif in speech

The example in the remark near the end of the lesson does not have a negation in the main verb, so it wouldn't need 'ne' explétif. In fact, it's exactly the same phrase that was used in the first example in this lesson: Il est venu sans que tu le saches.

This question relates to:
French lesson "Sans que (+ ne explétif) + Le Subjonctif = Without doing"


Kwiziq language super star

30 January 2016


Bonjour Yury, The ne explétif is not necessarily related to negation in the main clause. There are certain verbs and expressions, like sans que, that call for the ne explétif. So the point is that you can say both Il est venu sans que tu ne le saches or Il est venu sans que tu le saches.


Kwiziq community member

20 February 2016


Bonjour Laura, Merci beaucoup pour votre explication. However, I am afraid that this point is missing in the explanation in the lesson on "sans que" (How to use ''sans que'' with or without 'ne' explétif + Subjonctif = 'without you doing'). The lesson says: " If the main verb is not used with negations, then you CANNOT use the 'ne' explétif." Please consider amending the lesson's text to cover all the possibilities. Thank you very much!


Kwiziq community member

21 September 2018


I think the example you're referring to is gone or changed. Anyway, I was confused after this conversation and found this:

Mais, dans les propositions introduites par sans que, lorsqu’elles s’insèrent dans un contexte négatif, on peut utiliser le ne dit explétif, que n’exige pas la correction grammaticale, mais qui est recommandé dans la langue soutenue. Il vient sans qu’on l’en ait prié, Il ne vient jamais sans qu’on l’en ait prié ou sans qu’on ne l’en ait prié sont toutes des phrases correctes. Seule la phrase Il vient sans qu’on ne l’en ait prié serait fautive.

Being a heathen, I plan to never use it with "sans que", to be on the safe side :-)

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